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Is "white" a COLOR?
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Josh



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 796
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VGOD,

I'd like to highlight a few statements you made:

Quote:
It is the same issue. There aren't two separate issues. The act of racism (mistreatment of people on the basis of color) produces in effect...white supremacy. One cause...one effect. That is the reason they are equal...the same. The classification of and function of color...in effect...is racism (white supremacy).




Quote:
Saying and Doing...that is what it boils down to...not hair, not nose shape...all of those things are what white people use to confuse non-white people and keep non-white people focused on anything other than what a white person says as a white person and what a white person does as a white person.




Quote:
I suspect you are a white person that knows the difference between being a white person and being a non-white person in a SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) and that alone is enough for you to be considered a racist suspect. Once we get away from color all we have is saying and doing. And we have gotten away from color because no person is the same color as a white crayon and no person is the same color as a black crayon. Therefore, all I'm talking about is function.



Quote:
For the benefit of non-white people I'll explain...I said under the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) color equals function....color doesn't equal skin tone. There are "non-white" people that look like (have the same skin tone) white people and white people that look like (have the same skin tone) non-white people.





Thank you for taking the time to include these peices of counter racism code. They are very helpful to me in my ability to focus on the dynamics of a system and the actions/reactions of their component parts. I found this peice to be of particular interest:

Saying and Doing...that is what it boils down to...not hair, not nose shape...all of those things are what white people use to confuse non-white people and keep non-white people focused on anything other than what a white person says as a white person and what a white person does as a white person.


You've been saying it for a While now but I think I finally REALLY get it.

I hope to reflect my greater understanding in my future postings.

Thanks,

Josh
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cloudsong



Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 327
Location: Arlington VA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That goes for me too, I hope to reflect my greater understanding in future postings too.

Virtual God, is this what you're saying -- in synopsis:

Color is function;
Function is either as Royalty or as servants to royalty

Royalty is white;
White is function

Function is either as royalty or as servants oppressed by and serving royalty...

perfect circle of logic, seems logical
cloudsong
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 8:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

cloudsong wrote:
That goes for me too, I hope to reflect my greater understanding in future postings too.

Virtual God, is this what you're saying -- in synopsis:

Color is function;
Function is either as Royalty or as servants to royalty

Yes, in a SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) function is either white supremacist (racist), a white person, or a victim of racism/white supremacy (non-white person).

cloudsong wrote:
Royalty is white;
White is function

Yes, in a SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism).

cloudsong wrote:
Function is either as royalty or as servants oppressed by and serving royalty...

Yes, in a SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) function is either white supremacist (racist), a white person, or a victim of racism/white supremacy (non-white person).

cloudsong wrote:
perfect circle of logic, seems logical
cloudsong

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cloudsong



Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 327
Location: Arlington VA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good! I guess I studied your words long enough to get the logic of them!

I'm not the most logical white person in the barrel. My white friends despair of me that I think more wholistically than logically, more intuitively. And I don't think ahead like most white people value. I "think behind".

But I am trying to follow the logic here and answer questions as helpfully as I can. I can post more on the economics area if desired.

Perhaps I knew intuitively, what I had to study your logic to figure out. On the other hand, I don't think white people are as omniscient about white supremacy/racism as you think we are. As a white person I don't know as much about white supremacy as people have told me I should know. But I share any thoughts and knowledge I have. cloudsong
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 29, 2004 10:21 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

cloudsong wrote:
You're welcome. I hope I help.

Wow, economics is a big area.

The way a white person acts and talks versus a white supremacist in the area of economics is that a white person wants equality and equal access to resources for all people, and a white supremacist doesn't.

White People: Wants equality and equal access to resources for all people.
White Supremacists (Racists): Doesn't.

What does a white supremacist (racist) do to ensure this does not take place? I suspect a white supremacist (racist) views all non-white people as equal resources and treats (mistreats) non-white people accordingly. Is this true?

What does a white person do to make sure all people get "equality and equal access to resources for all people" in the current SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism)? Just wanting it is not enough. I want to win the lottery but if I don't do something about it, like buy a lottery ticket, I ain't gonna win.

cloudsong wrote:
Can you narrow it a bit and give me an idea of a focus in which you're most interested, Virtual God?


Yes, I can narrow it down a bit. Let's just focus on what we have above and place aside all that you have written thus far about what a white person says and/or does versus what a white supremacist (racist) says and/or does in all areas of people activity. We'll get to other examples you've given but let's just focus on the illustration you laid out above and the questions/answers that are a reult of it.
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cloudsong



Joined: 12 Feb 2004
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Location: Arlington VA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 29, 2004 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Virtual God, I have to say upfront that when I answer as to what a white supremacist thinks or does, it is from observation of the world and my own deductiive reasoning and from things said to me about unjust people by just people who are trying to create a better world.

It is not from people who are white supremacists telling me these things directly and out front. I don't remember ever in my life being told specifically the answers to these questions by someone who practices injustice.

I can listen to someone saying one thing, and I can deduce what he is really saying, with my third ear. But I don't think white supremacists ever directly say what they are doing.

And the close people in my own life think like I do. I don't associate with people who I feel are unjust.

Having said that, yes I would say that a white supremacist by definition sees non-white people as resources. Starting with slavery and continuing in a different, more subtle, way.

It would be clearest for me if I take one of your questions at at time, get feedback, before I proceed with too many answers and words.

So to answer your first question which is "What does a white supremacist do to ensure this does not take place" ("THIS" meaning "equality and equal access to resources for all people") --

A white supremacist creates governments and systems of injustice in the world where non-white countries and persons have incorrect opportunity and access to resources.

Systems of injustice such as systemic job discrimination,

tax laws that favor the rich and mostly white

unjust occupations and colonializations of non-white countries

Those are just three examples, but I can give other examples if this line of answering is anwering your question as you meant it.

cloudsong
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cloudsong



Joined: 12 Feb 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To clarify my first few paragraphs:

I've heard plenty of racist statements, like "black people whine", "black people blame white people" etc. etc.

But what I have not heard directly is plans of implementing white supremacy -

- well, other than in statements such as for example President Bush saying, "I am going to implement the Clear Skies Initiative". He might as well say, "I am going to make sure even more non-white children have asthma than white children".

But as far as hearing plans of implementation of white supremacy, I deduce such information indirectly.

cloudsong
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:05 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

cloudsong wrote:
Virtual God, I have to say upfront that when I answer as to what a white supremacist thinks or does, it is from observation of the world and my own deductiive reasoning and from things said to me about unjust people by just people who are trying to create a better world.

It is not from people who are white supremacists telling me these things directly and out front. I don't remember ever in my life being told specifically the answers to these questions by someone who practices injustice.

I can listen to someone saying one thing, and I can deduce what he is really saying, with my third ear. But I don't think white supremacists ever directly say what they are doing.

And the close people in my own life think like I do. I don't associate with people who I feel are unjust.

To me this means two things:

(1) If you so choose to practice racism (white supremacy) you can do it without asking another white person how to do it.
(2) White people have a code to accomplish number # (1).

You don't have to be told directly by a white person that practices white supremacy (racism) the logical mechanics for practicing racism (white supremacy) because the thought, speech, and action for practicing white supremacy (racism) is built into the language. This is the means by which white people who practice white supremacy (racism) are able to do so in all of the 9 major areas of people activity simultaneously and go virtually undetected in doing so since the victims of white supremacy (racism) use the same words with the same definitions.

Even though you have not been told how to practice white supremacy (racism) by a white supremacist (racist), directly, you can practice racism (white supremacy) if you so choose. Is this correct?

This is the reason that if a non-white person takes a logical approach to countering racism (white supremacy) the non-white person has no choice but to suspect you as being a racist suspect. I want to state for the record, before we go any further, that according to THE LOGIC you are a racist suspect because I have no mechanism for proving that you are not one.

cloudsong wrote:
Having said that, yes I would say that a white supremacist by definition sees non-white people as resources. Starting with slavery and continuing in a different, more subtle, way.

It would be clearest for me if I take one of your questions at at time, get feedback, before I proceed with too many answers and words.

So to answer your first question which is "What does a white supremacist do to ensure this does not take place" ("THIS" meaning "equality and equal access to resources for all people") --

A white supremacist creates governments and systems of injustice in the world where non-white countries and persons have incorrect opportunity and access to resources.

Systems of injustice such as systemic job discrimination,

tax laws that favor the rich and mostly white

unjust occupations and colonializations of non-white countries

Those are just three examples, but I can give other examples if this line of answering is anwering your question as you meant it.

cloudsong

No thank you...enough illustrations. Next question.

What does a white person do to ensure a white supremacist (racist) doesn't accomplish their goal of victimizing all of the non-white people?
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:08 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

cloudsong wrote:
To clarify my first few paragraphs:

I've heard plenty of racist statements, like "black people whine", "black people blame white people" etc. etc.

But what I have not heard directly is plans of implementing white supremacy -

- well, other than in statements such as for example President Bush saying, "I am going to implement the Clear Skies Initiative". He might as well say, "I am going to make sure even more non-white children have asthma than white children".

But as far as hearing plans of implementation of white supremacy, I deduce such information indirectly.

cloudsong

Are you saying George W. Bush is a racist (white supremacist)?
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cloudsong



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do think Bush is a racist white supremacist. I do especially think John Ashcroft is a racist white supremacist.

I want to tell you my attitude about that though, just so you know where I'm coming from. I understand that this is my own psychological view and is probably not shared, and I'm fine with agreeing to disagree on this -

- I think all evil and cruelty stems from hurt and fear. I think Ashcroft was hurt deeply psychically as a child or even on some developmental level in his mother's womb (I do think fetuses pick up emotional states and thoughts of the mother) or even just from Jungian subconscious hurt. Same with Hitler, Ken Starr, anyone who abuses anyone.

So I want you to know that because I think the solution to racism in these people and in all people is to get to the root of the hurt, not to further evil by adding more hurt. But I also believe black people must be protected from these people at all costs while their hurt and fear is being addressed, if it even can be.

I will answer your questions more, as soon as I can; right now I'm trying to find out where to go to protest the latest developments overnight in Haiti, which is abominable white supremacy, for one example of white supremacy and also this is an example of what white people can do to protect non-white people -- which is to note and protest each incident of white supremacy in the world. Which is billions. I also believe there are billions of correct incidents by non-racist white people toward non-white people - to give a balanced picture.

cloudsong
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

cloudsong wrote:
I do think Bush is a racist white supremacist. I do especially think John Ashcroft is a racist white supremacist.

Thank you.

cloudsong wrote:
I want to tell you my attitude about that though, just so you know where I'm coming from. I understand that this is my own psychological view and is probably not shared, and I'm fine with agreeing to disagree on this -

For future reference there is no need for you to give long explanations about why you say and/or do anything. I appreciate your efforts to clarify, but please allow me to ask for clarification if needed. I think this will allow our conversations to be more focused on the primary objective, which is to replace the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) with a SYSTEM of justice.

It is not logical for me to disagree with a white person that says another white person is a white supremacist (racist) since I have no logical way of determining if what that white person says is correct or incorrect.

cloudsong wrote:
- I think all evil and cruelty stems from hurt and fear. I think Ashcroft was hurt deeply psychically as a child or even on some developmental level in his mother's womb (I do think fetuses pick up emotional states and thoughts of the mother) or even just from Jungian subconscious hurt. Same with Hitler, Ken Starr, anyone who abuses anyone.

So I want you to know that because I think the solution to racism in these people and in all people is to get to the root of the hurt, not to further evil by adding more hurt. But I also believe black people must be protected from these people at all costs while their hurt and fear is being addressed, if it even can be.

I will answer your questions more, as soon as I can; right now I'm trying to find out where to go to protest the latest developments overnight in Haiti, which is abominable white supremacy, for one example of white supremacy and also this is an example of what white people can do to protect non-white people -- which is to note and protest each incident of white supremacy in the world. Which is billions. I also believe there are billions of correct incidents by non-racist white people toward non-white people - to give a balanced picture.

cloudsong

Protest is not counter racism (white supremacy).
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RangerX



Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 141

PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Is White a Color ?"

Following the LOGIC,

White is not a Color...

According to *White* People who classify themselves and each other as *White* People, and, who classify all other People as People of *Color*.

White People have decided and made it a rule that White is not a Color (when applied to classifying People by Skin Color)

They are White People, "Colorless" People as compared to those People who they have classified as "C o l o r e d People" (i:e:, "Niggers", "Chinks", "Gooks", "Spics", "Kikes", "Sand Niggers", etc).

You do not have to look "far" to see that this is true,

Observe how White People classify People and decide who is a "Majority" and who is a "MINORity", but most importantly, White People decide, by Color and Non-Color, who gets to Function as a Majority and who gets to Function as a Minority.

what is the BASIS/Determining factor for deciding who is a Majority and who is a *MINOR*ity ?

Color

"White"(Majority) or "Colored" (Minority)

But Is "White" a Color ?

We should ask a *White* Person!

-RangerX
RWSWJ
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is white a color?

White Supremacy Defined
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cloudsong



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Virtual God, I don't understand why protest isn't counter racism, if a white person is protesting an incident of racism...

Oh, a lightbulb just went off :) - do you mean the protest has to be combined with a counter ACTION that counters the racism, not just protesting the racism?

I do agree with that come to think of it, if that is what you mean.

I hope it's okay to give more on what white and non-white people can do to counter racism.

We must vigilantly and constantly counter racism in the billion ways that racism occurs.

Right now one of the billion ways is in Haiti where our government has just staged a coup, with long term plans to take over the country and put in leaders of our liking. I am not sure yet what the ultimate purpose is that our leaders have for Haiti. I hope it will be revealed.

In addition to protesting, our first action compenent is to first get the word out to the American people that the mainstream media is giving us disinformation (in fact Aristide has now gotten a phone call to a member of the Congressional Black Caucus that he WAS kidnapped by American forces)

- and second action component is to call for hearings on this matter of our government overthrowing a democratically elected president of a black country - call your congressional representative, demand this;

- and third, to call for the impeachment of whatever officials were involved in this incident, including Bush.

Even though both white and non-white people can do this, it is especially important for white people to do these things so as to show white supremacists that non-racist white people of this country will NOT support the white supremacy involved in the Haiti coup.

cloudsong
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cloudsong



Joined: 12 Feb 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, white is a color according to the logic:

Color is function --

White is function --

White functions as royalty; color determines who functions as royalty;

therefore white is a color.

Is that logical?
cloudsong
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