HomeCounter-Racism Radio NetworkCounter-Racism Television NetworkArticlesProjectsCounter-Racism Work/Study ProjectShopping MallContact
Secure DonationsSecure Donations  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  RegisterRegister  ProfileProfile  Log inLog in

Experiments For Defintions

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Counter-Racism Work/Study Project Forum Index -> Following THE LOGIC
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
HelixHair



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 383
Location: Everywhere that is nowhere

PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 1:45 pm    Post subject: Experiments For Defintions Reply with quote

To anyone who is able:

Please explain how, using the scientific method, an experiment is designed and performed to show the counter-racist value of a suggested definition for a word/term?

One or more examples would be most helpful.
_________________
Death of the lower body is certain. Now what?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3081
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:39 am    Post subject: Re: Experiments For Defintions Reply with quote

HelixHair wrote:
To anyone who is able:

Please explain how, using the scientific method, an experiment is designed and performed to show the counter-racist value of a suggested definition for a word/term?

One or more examples would be most helpful.

What do you mean when you say "counter-racist value"?
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
HelixHair



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 383
Location: Everywhere that is nowhere

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Experiments For Defintions Reply with quote

Edward Williams wrote:
HelixHair wrote:
To anyone who is able:

Please explain how, using the scientific method, an experiment is designed and performed to show the counter-racist value of a suggested definition for a word/term?

One or more examples would be most helpful.

What do you mean when you say \\\"counter-racist value\\\"?


counter-racist value = 'result of a counter-racism science experiment ' as used in your reply to Eduardo Small shown below in the defintionary forum:

Edward Williams wrote:
Eduardo Small wrote:
Hypocrite - A person that lies to themself.

Mr. Small,

Is this counter-racism definition a result of a counter-racism science experiment that has been posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum that has been run and the data from that counter-racism science experiment also posted in the same thread as the counter-racism science experiment?


The link to that post is HERE
_________________
Death of the lower body is certain. Now what?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3081
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, and thank you for the question. Also, thank you for capturing the post as it will be deleted soon.

I think I understand the question. Let me start, in preface, by offering you the premise if I may. The premise, as the FAQ points out if it is followed, is to only post words and their definitions in the Counter-Racism Definitionary that have been used in counter-racism science experiments that are posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, that have been run, and that have the data also posted in the the same thread as the counter-racism science experiment.

That may sound complicated for some so I'll attempt to simplify. The way the process should work, according to the FAQ, is for a person to observe the behavior of people, including the outcome if they so choose, that they think is necessary to test in a counter-racism science experiment. The person can get the idea from something that happened to them or someone else in the past and/or something that is happening to them and/or someone else currently.

    Post the counter-racism science experiment in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, run the counter-racism science experiment, post the data of the counter-racism science experiment that resulted after running it in the same thread as the counter-racism science experiment. That is the flow of using the WSP. All other forums on the WSP should only be used as a result of this flow.

As a result of running a counter-racism science experiment there are words that have been used. There is no way around this. Whether the words are thought or spoken. Somewhere in the process someone used words.

People can ask questions and give answers about words and their definitions, for the purpose of refinement, by using the Using Words Correctly forum that tie back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, make suggestions about specific words and their usage in the Counter-Racism Strategies and Techniques forum that tie back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, and/or post the word and its definition that was used in a counter-racism science experiment that ties back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum.

That is how the process should work. I can only suspect that non-white people don't generally want to follow this process for many reasons, one of which is it takes the glory and praise off the person whose making the suggestion. But if people are to stand on their own two feet, as individuals, and attempt to replace the SYSTEM of racism (white supremacy) with a SYSTEM of justice using a process that allows them to test and measure what they have tested scientifically the WSP is one tool they can use and share their work with other people that are doing the same things.

Our habits are to post something without any substantiating evidence that it will work or that it has worked. Others look at it and they want to know if using this word or that action will work and are unable to determine the outcome because no scientific evidence has been presented. I call this method "trail and error". Which also leads the person to follow the person that posted it if it does work, rather than following THE LOGIC (Counter-Racism Logic). If someone posts a suggestion and someone else uses it and it works, when that person needs another suggestion that have to go back to the person that gave them the first suggestion. In essence the person that posted the initial suggestion is doing your thinking for you and if they are doing your thinking for you then you are following them. Using what is called the "scientific method" causes you to do your own thinking.

The scientific method is primarily used test and determine whether what you suspect to be true is actually true and can also used to test and determine the best way to solve problems without producing more problems. This is the "counter-racist value". The flow spoken of earlier in this post is THE LOGIC for achieving the "counter-racist value".

Two examples are, and if more are needed and there is time I can post some or point you to some, the use of the term "due process" and the use of the word "problem" while in the process of running the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool.

In the process of running the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment my focus was to attempt to solve problems without producing more problems. I began to write a lot of what was happening as a result of running the experiment and it was Fuller's suggestion to write a book about it. I have a lot of the data already written in my lab book so I can post it if need be. I did, however, post the due process definition and the problem definition in the Counter-Racism Definitionary. These definitions were posted with the tie back to the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment.

What is not in the thread of the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment is the data that lead to the suggested definitions. I'll update these today with the information I already have. The idea is for the person viewing the suggestion, whether in definition form, strategy form, technique form, etc., to be able to look at the suggestion and be able to tie it back to how the person came up with that suggestion by studying the person counter-racism science experiment and the data that results from running the counter-racism science experiment and the person studying should be quickly able to link to all information with the links posted in the suggestion to the counter-racism science experiment that was run that also has the data posted in the same thread of the counter-racism science experiment.

Logically speaking, if the person cannot follow THE LOGIC of the suggestion all the way back to its inception and study what produced it in a scientific manner, and work it in a scientific manner, and refine it in a scientific manner, the suggestion regardless as to the form, has no counter-racism value. What I mean when I say counter-racism value is that it can be used toward the production of justice.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
HelixHair



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 383
Location: Everywhere that is nowhere

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:40 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Edward Williams wrote:
Yes, and thank you for the question. Also, thank you for capturing the post as it will be deleted soon.

I think I understand the question. Let me start, in preface, by offering you the premise if I may. The premise, as the FAQ points out if it is followed, is to only post words and their definitions in the Counter-Racism Definitionary that have been used in counter-racism science experiments that are posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, that have been run, and that have the data also posted in the the same thread as the counter-racism science experiment.

That may sound complicated for some so I'll attempt to simplify. The way the process should work, according to the FAQ, is for a person to observe the behavior of people, including the outcome if they so choose, that they think is necessary to test in a counter-racism science experiment. The person can get the idea from something that happened to them or someone else in the past and/or something that is happening to them and/or someone else currently.

    Post the counter-racism science experiment in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, run the counter-racism science experiment, post the data of the counter-racism science experiment that resulted after running it in the same thread as the counter-racism science experiment. That is the flow of using the WSP. All other forums on the WSP should only be used as a result of this flow.

As a result of running a counter-racism science experiment there are words that have been used. There is no way around this. Whether the words are thought or spoken. Somewhere in the process someone used words.

People can ask questions and give answers about words and their definitions, for the purpose of refinement, by using the Using Words Correctly forum that tie back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, make suggestions about specific words and their usage in the Counter-Racism Strategies and Techniques forum that tie back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum, and/or post the word and its definition that was used in a counter-racism science experiment that ties back to the data and the experiment that is posted in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum.

That is how the process should work. I can only suspect that non-white people don't generally want to follow this process for many reasons, one of which is it takes the glory and praise off the person whose making the suggestion. But if people are to stand on their own two feet, as individuals, and attempt to replace the SYSTEM of racism (white supremacy) with a SYSTEM of justice using a process that allows them to test and measure what they have tested scientifically the WSP is one tool they can use and share their work with other people that are doing the same things.

Our habits are to post something without any substantiating evidence that it will work or that it has worked. Others look at it and they want to know if using this word or that action will work and are unable to determine the outcome because no scientific evidence has been presented. I call this method \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"trail and error\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\". Which also leads the person to follow the person that posted it if it does work, rather than following THE LOGIC (Counter-Racism Logic). If someone posts a suggestion and someone else uses it and it works, when that person needs another suggestion that have to go back to the person that gave them the first suggestion. In essence the person that posted the initial suggestion is doing your thinking for you and if they are doing your thinking for you then you are following them. Using what is called the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"scientific method\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" causes you to do your own thinking.

The scientific method is primarily used test and determine whether what you suspect to be true is actually true and can also used to test and determine the best way to solve problems without producing more problems. This is the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"counter-racist value\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\". The flow spoken of earlier in this post is THE LOGIC for achieving the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"counter-racist value\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\".

Two examples are, and if more are needed and there is time I can post some or point you to some, the use of the term \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"due process\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" and the use of the word \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"problem\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" while in the process of running the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool.

In the process of running the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment my focus was to attempt to solve problems without producing more problems. I began to write a lot of what was happening as a result of running the experiment and it was Fuller's suggestion to write a book about it. I have a lot of the data already written in my lab book so I can post it if need be. I did, however, post the due process definition and the problem definition in the Counter-Racism Definitionary. These definitions were posted with the tie back to the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment.

What is not in the thread of the Using The U.S. Constitution as a Tool counter-racism science experiment is the data that lead to the suggested definitions. I'll update these today with the information I already have. The idea is for the person viewing the suggestion, whether in definition form, strategy form, technique form, etc., to be able to look at the suggestion and be able to tie it back to how the person came up with that suggestion by studying the person counter-racism science experiment and the data that results from running the counter-racism science experiment and the person studying should be quickly able to link to all information with the links posted in the suggestion to the counter-racism science experiment that was run that also has the data posted in the same thread of the counter-racism science experiment.

Logically speaking, if the person cannot follow THE LOGIC of the suggestion all the way back to its inception and study what produced it in a scientific manner, and work it in a scientific manner, and refine it in a scientific manner, the suggestion regardless as to the form, has no counter-racism value. What I mean when I say counter-racism value is that it can be used toward the production of justice.


Thank you for that response, Mr. Williams.

I do not yet understand how the scientific method has been used in the example you used. I do, however, understand that it is not likely to be constructive for me to question you any further about that. There are so many constructive activities on this web site. And, I do agree that Counter-Racism should be a scientific discipline.

Is there a place on this web site where experiences that posters have had using particular terms can be posted? If so, these or other posters can examine the data for patterns and then propose one or more hypotheses to explain the pattern for which experiments (for which results can be quantified) can then be designed to test the counter-racist value of the use of the terms. I could be incorrect, but I think there is a critical difference between 'experiences' and 'experiments' in gaining more scientific knowledge/ability to counter Racism (White Supremacy).
_________________
Death of the lower body is certain. Now what?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3081
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 10:22 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

HelixHair wrote:
Thank you for that response, Mr. Williams.

I do not yet understand how the scientific method has been used in the example you used. I do, however, understand that it is not likely to be constructive for me to question you any further about that. There are so many constructive activities on this web site. And, I do agree that Counter-Racism should be a scientific discipline.

Perhaps you have a different definition and understanding than I do of what the word "science" is.

By saying this I understand that this may not be clear either...but in the example I used, the use of the word "problem" and the use of the word or term "due process" were part of a counter-racism science experiment, using what is called the "scientific method", that is designed to solve a problem without producing more problems. I maintain, because I have not figured out yet how to do it or the practical value for doing it, that there is no way use what is called the "scientific method" to test a word, and only that word, in isolation, without testing anything else and in the process of doing so solve a problem without producing more problems. Now I'm not saying it cannot be done but I am saying that I haven't found a use for doing it and I don't know what the practical value for doing it would be.

Someone once came to me with what they called a scientific experiment that they wanted me to run with them where we placed the words "White Is Fading Away" on t-shirts and rode the train practically all day recording the response of white people. I asked them what problems is this "scientific experiment" designed to solve? They didn't know. I asked them what are the expected results and what is the practical value for producing these expected results? They didn't know. So I refused to run it with them.

I wrote a counter-racism science experiment called The Best Word To Use that is designed to help a person come up with the best definition for a word and that experiment uses what is called the "scientific method" but I am not sure if problems are produced while in the process of running that counter-racism science experiment.

In the process of mastering words so that the words are used such that the person using the words are not harmed and the person gets the help they need when they need it and that these two things are done toward the production of a thing called justice...I maintain that no word can be used toward this end in isolation. They have to be used with other words.

HelixHair wrote:
Is there a place on this web site where experiences that posters have had using particular terms can be posted? If so, these or other posters can examine the data for patterns and then propose one or more hypotheses to explain the pattern for which experiments (for which results can be quantified) can then be designed to test the counter-racist value of the use of the terms. I could be incorrect, but I think there is a critical difference between 'experiences' and 'experiments' in gaining more scientific knowledge/ability to counter Racism (White Supremacy).

Sure, I explained the process the post I made before this one.

A person who has had an experience using a word and/or has been part of an experience where someone else used a word that they would like to test in a scientific manner using what is called the "scientific method", can think about their experience using the word or their experience when someone else used a word and post their own counter-racism science experiment, in the form of what is called the "scientific method", in the Counter-Racism Science Project forum that they are going to run. Run that counter-racism science experiment and post the data that results from running that counter-racism science experiment in the same thread that the counter-racism science experiment is written.

This is the process for continual growth and refinement. There is no way to follow THE LOGIC if you end up following a person. Once you have to keep going to a person you have crystallized your product. The racists (white supremacists) understand this, which is why they promote what are called "black leaders"...wait until they have a pretty good following and are really on the move toward producing whatever they set out to produce...then they kill the so-called "black leader" which in turn kills the so-called movement. You'd think we would've learned that by now.

Once we get into a discussion of people's experiences people begin to follow each other rather than following THE LOGIC and testing what is said in a scientific manner using what is called the "scientific method". It places too much emphasis on a person and not enough emphasis on THE LOGIC. I go into this in detail in the book that I'm writing where I point out the differences between what is called "trail and error" and what is called the "scientific method". This is the reason people keep going to Fuller. That is who they are following if Fuller is having to keep giving them things to say and/or things to do. There is nothing incorrect about getting ideas from people but the process after you get the idea is to follow THE LOGIC of the idea...not the person. In the minds of many people counter-racism is a product that has been crystallized with Fuller. When people think of counter-racism they think of Fuller. People even call it Fuller-ism when others talk about counter-racism.

On one hand you have the natural instinct of people and on the other hand you have control. If you are to one extreme you become very un-scientific. If you are to the other extreme you become a mechanical person, presumably unable to become humane. The objective is to combine the two in harmony with each other. So that you have what is called natural-unnaturalness or unnatural-naturalness. That may sound to philosophical but that is what the promotion of counter-racism science is supposed to produce among a people who are very emotional people. Having emotion on one hand and logic on the other. If you are at one extreme you are very un-scientific and if you are to the other extreme you become a mechanical person, presumably unable to become humane. The objective is to combine the two in harmony.

I'd also like to say, and I apologize for the length of this response, there is no way to run an experiment without having experiences. And there is no way to have experiences without experiments being run under the SYSTEM of racism (white supremacy). All non-white people are part of racist scientific experiments right now!
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3081
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 10:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

RecoveringAa wrote:
Blacktastically Stated!
blacktastically = GREAT, I concur, Well stated,..
Seems you are acknowledging the VARIOUS TYPES of Scientific Resarch!
Also, seems you would like to take into account or count as experiences based on data \\\"Scientist Researchers\\\". chalk up to \\\"anecdotal data\\\" and therefore, disqualify it.


Thank you for Sharing.
Abena

Abena,

Are you asking a question or answering a question with your last post?
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3081
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 6:32 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

RecoveringAa wrote:
Edward Williams wrote:
RecoveringAa wrote:
Blacktastically Stated!
blacktastically = GREAT, I concur, Well stated,..
Seems you are acknowledging the VARIOUS TYPES of Scientific Resarch!
Also, seems you would like to take into account or count as experiences based on data "Scientist Researchers". chalk up to "anecdotal data" and therefore, disqualify it.


Thank you for Sharing.
Abena

Abena,

Are you asking a question or answering a question with your last post?

No. I offered my agreement with what was stated.
The implication being that their ARE many TYPES of scientific research methods. What is presented here at counter-racism is but one.
Would you agree with this?
Abena

It depends on what you mean when you say "scientific research methods".

The Following THE LOGIC forum should never be used for discussion purposes. Ask questions about how the SYSTEM of racism (white supremacy) works and/or how to counter it. Answer with the compensatory counter-racism logic.

"Signing on" to what people say only helps to promote people and doesn't help to promote counter-racism logic. Non-white people are in a pitiful state under this SYSTEM but we keep doing the same things...things that help to keep us in the condition we're in.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Counter-Racism Work/Study Project Forum Index -> Following THE LOGIC All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Web CalendarShopping MallDonations