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Doing Away With "Down"?
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melaninmagic



Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 22
Location: Tha Land of Make Believe

PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

If by "exists in thought and speech" you mean in my imagination, then yes. I'd have to agree.

However, what exists in my imagination does not necessarily exist in physical reality. And in my estimate, existing in physical reality is the most important thing. What is in my imagination is inconsequential, and not worth discussion.

The assumption I made was that when you posted the original question, you were refering to "Justice" within the context of physical reality and not within the context of physical imagination.

The actual word Justice exists in thought if you are thinking about the word, and in speech if you are uttering the word. These are still imaginary products until someone actually produces the product.

Justice within the context of Neely Fuller's definition is NOT just a word. It is more importantly a physical product. Injustice is also a physical product based on Neely Fuller's definition. They cannot exist if they were not produced. Speech and thought cannot bring a product from the realm of imagination into the realm of physical reality.

For instance, I may say "Vanilla-Strawberry-Chocolate Cake and Justice exists".

Because the actual words exist, does this necessariily mean that the products to which these words refer exist? Or course not! Only by action, can these two items be made manifest.

Persons classified as Non-White do not possess the ability to produce the product called Justice. The persons who classify themselves as White do not have the desire to produce the product called Justice. Therefore, the product called Justice does not exist, even though the actual word Justice exists in thought and speech.
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Edward Williams
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

melaninmagic wrote:
If by "exists in thought and speech" you mean in my imagination, then yes. I'd have to agree.

No sir, not only your imagination but in the words that you speak. One thing non-white people like to do a lot of is talking. We talk and talk and talk and talk. But not many of use listen and think.

If something exists in speech that means people are able, to some degree, talk about it...articulate sounds in reference to it. No person should take things on face value. We should all listen to what is being said and think about it...critically.

So justice does exist in thought and in speech but it may not exist in practice as you have defined it, which is all you had to say from the very beginning. There's no way to get justice, as you have defined it, to exist in practice unless it exists in thought and speech first.

melaninmagic wrote:
However, what exists in my imagination does not necessarily exist in physical reality. And in my estimate, existing in physical reality is the most important thing. What is in my imagination is inconsequential, and not worth discussion.

The assumption I made was that when you posted the original question, you were refering to "Justice" within the context of physical reality and not within the context of physical imagination.

The actual word Justice exists in thought if you are thinking about the word, and in speech if you are uttering the word. These are still imaginary products until someone actually produces the product.

Justice within the context of Neely Fuller's definition is NOT just a word. It is more importantly a physical product. Injustice is also a physical product based on Neely Fuller's definition. They cannot exist if they were not produced. Speech and thought cannot bring a product from the realm of imagination into the realm of physical reality.

For instance, I may say "Vanilla-Strawberry-Chocolate Cake and Justice exists".

Because the actual words exist, does this necessariily mean that the products to which these words refer exist? Or course not! Only by action, can these two items be made manifest.

Persons classified as Non-White do not possess the ability to produce the product called Justice.

If non-white people don't posses the ability to produce justice then why are you talking about it? These are the kinds of things being said that are a total contradiction.

melaninmagic wrote:
The persons who classify themselves as White do not have the desire to produce the product called Justice. Therefore, the product called Justice does not exist, even though the actual word Justice exists in thought and speech.

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melaninmagic



Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 22
Location: Tha Land of Make Believe

PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

I am forced to talk about it because I am responding to your original post by supplying you with an answer. I cannot do this without refering to the subject of the post.

I understand that the most I can do is compensate for the lack of Justice, but cannot actually produce it. As stated, the product called Justice and the product called Injustice are mutually exclusive. I am able to think and talk about it, but cannot action it into existance. I have never deviated from this.

Your original question was: "Why do people say that you can't have justice and injustice in the same universe at the same time?"

My explanation provides, as best as I can, an answer to this question.

I am inclined to suspect that Mr. Neely Fuller and for that matter, anyone else who suggests that Justice cannot exist in the same universe as Racism/White Supremacy would also agree with my conclusion for exactly the same reasons.

If my answer is insufficient for you, then I cannot do any more than this.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

melaninmagic wrote:
I am forced to talk about it because I am responding to your original post by supplying you with an answer. I cannot do this without refering to the subject of the post.

I understand that the most I can do is compensate for the lack of Justice, but cannot actually produce it. As stated, the product called Justice and the product called Injustice are mutually exclusive. I am able to think and talk about it, but cannot action it into existance. I have never deviated from this.

Your original question was: "Why do people say that you can't have justice and injustice in the same universe at the same time?"

My explanation provides, as best as I can, an answer to this question.

I am inclined to suspect that Mr. Neely Fuller and for that matter, anyone else who suggests that Justice cannot exist in the same universe as Racism/White Supremacy would also agree with my conclusion for exactly the same reasons.

If my answer is insufficient for you, then I cannot do any more than this.

Thank you sir. In the process of having this discussion we found out that you can have justice and injustice in the same universe at the same time in some form. It's the practice of justice, as you have defined it, where the distinction lies.
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Dan Freeman



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:05 am    Post subject: Unqualified Logic Reply with quote

Logic cannot determine the truth of its premise. This is done by another faculty.

To say that one cannot have Justice & Injustice at the same time is problematic. This suggests one condition must be eliminated for the other to exist. See where that's going? If not careful, such logic could potentially lead a well intentioned individual to unwittingly become what they claim to be against.
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melaninmagic



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Location: Tha Land of Make Believe

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:29 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

But is this not what Neely Fuller was trying to get at in the first place?

That Justice cannot be practiced/produced as long as the system of Racism/White Supremacy exists (Injustice)?
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

melaninmagic wrote:
But is this not what Neely Fuller was trying to get at in the first place?

That Justice cannot be practiced/produced as long as the system of Racism/White Supremacy exists (Injustice)?

Hey, this ain't about Fuller. This is about you. This is about each individual non-white person and what they are willing to say and do to bring about a world that they believe they were born to bring about.

The racists (white supremacists) understand this. They brought about a world in which they were the minority in terms of the numbers of people. They brought about a world in which, although they faced numerical inadequacy in a world of a non-white majority, they are the most powerful people on the planet. They understand that although each individual white person...even though a minority...were going to have to choose to act as part of the system of racism (white supremacy), at a time and place of their own choosing, in order to bring about the kind of world power where they can have all of the non-white people subject to them. And they passed that unjust system down from generation to generation...for hundreds of years.

The question is not what Fuller means but what YOU mean. What are you willing to say and do to bring about a world that you believe you were born to bring about?
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